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51  General / The Forum / Re: Farewell NHS on: March 22, 2012, 21:19:41
Exploring the statement that we all have a "right to health care" (that you owe sick people for their healthcare) from a libertarian perspective using the argument from morality.

Very interesting!

http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig6/molyneux9.html

Would like to know the opinions of those in favour of government supplied healthcare on this argument?
I think that the article misframes the entire argument.  It seems to imply that the provision of healthcare (and by extension the entire Government) must only be guided by objective fact alone rather than moral beliefs.  I disagree.

Moral beliefs have to be universal, otherwise they are just opinions, this is what he's saying, if something is a moral fact it must be absolute and universal. He then explores the statement that "everyone has a right to healthcare" and what that means, and whether it is actually just a moral opinon or if it can be defended as universal and absolute.

It doesn't seem that outlandish to suggest that if a state that uses violence to extract money from people to enforce moral opinions it is wrong, and if it uses it to enforce moral absolutes such as murder etc. it isn't. Surely you must agree that a state that uses indefensible statements to support necessitates forcibly extracting £100bn from the population every year it is operating unethically, and so it must matter whether that statement stands up to logical scrutiny?

52  General / The Forum / Re: Farewell NHS on: March 22, 2012, 20:06:22
Exploring the statement that we all have a "right to health care" (that you owe sick people for their healthcare) from a libertarian perspective using the argument from morality.

Very interesting!

http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig6/molyneux9.html

Would like to know the opinions of those in favour of government supplied healthcare on this argument?
53  General / The Forum / Re: The budget - will it be for poors? I suspect not... on: March 22, 2012, 19:02:09
Ah my bad, I always thought it was Gordon who deregulated financial markets.

He did, but the process was started by the Americans in the 70's and then the Tories in the 80's. The person who was running his banking regulation department, Adair Turner, said something like "We thought banks were better off regulating themselves" recently, and Gordon obviously told him to work in that way so he's as much to blame as any other government.

All of them incrementally deregulate now because they all want to think they have the banks in their pocket and want to hear the banks telling them that what they are doing will "keep Britain on the map". In return for allowing banks to ruin the country by misappropriating and controlling the only money we're allowed to use, they get nice jobs paying over £1 million working for banks like Tony did.

54  General / The Forum / Re: The budget - will it be for poors? I suspect not... on: March 22, 2012, 18:28:06
And we also elected the Tories who deregulated financial markets in the 80's which allowed them to leverage and take risk to the extent that they did and cost us such a vast sum of money.

No matter who you vote for, the government gets in and they always answer to the banks. If we didn't bail them out, we wouldn't have any state currency, and then how would they collect taxes, and how would their schoolfriends take them on nice holidays and give them nice jobs after they've finished stealing for a living?
55  General / The Forum / Re: The budget - will it be for poors? I suspect not... on: March 22, 2012, 18:12:10

'A banker of £5m will get an extra £240,000 a year as a result of the reduction in the top rate of income tax.... same old tories'


But if less of those bankers decide to move to Luxembourg to do their job as a result, the treasury actually gains £2.2m.

And if as many of them as possible run off as a result the next time they come running for cash we might not have to fork over the best part of a trillion quid. The bailouts amounted to 145 million people claiming £6k of benefits. It's pretty indicative of our collective stupidity that we want to keep them here anymore at all.
56  Food for your Ears / The Desk / Re: Sound Proofing. on: March 19, 2012, 12:14:01

If you treat a room with absorptive materials then your very aim is to deaden.

By dead zones I mean ares of the frequency spectrum you are cancelling out.
57  General / The Forum / Re: GAMERS! on: March 19, 2012, 11:12:10
Tribes Ascend Open Beta is started Cheesy
58  Food for your Ears / The Desk / Re: Sound Proofing. on: March 19, 2012, 10:21:41
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/dec07/articles/acoustics.htm

Quote
It is very important to understand that acoustic treatment is not the same thing as soundproofing — a common misconception amongst the uninitiated. We can look into that another time but, as a general rule, the things you do to improve the listening accuracy of a room usually have negligible effect on the amount of sound that leaks into or out of that room. Indeed, an acoustically treated room may sound 'quieter' for a given monitor speaker level than an untreated room, and this could lead you to turn up the volume, so the sound leakage problem actually gets worse!

highly unlikely that you'll introduce more dead zones than you started with by treating your room


59  Food for your Ears / The Desk / Re: Sound Proofing. on: March 19, 2012, 07:09:05
Build some acoustic absorber panels out of rockwool RWA45, there's loads of guides on the internet - won't absorb all the bass but it will definitely help.

It won’t stop sound transferring through the walls. If anything it'll potentially make it worse as the absorption will mean higher monitoring levels are required. The best way to prevent sound transmission is through de-coupling; ideally a room within a room or providing an air gap.

For bass traps you are better off with RW60 used in a double layer.


Of course it won't make it worse, lower monitoring levels are needed as you aren't hearing all the reflections, you need lower volume as you have increased clarity.

4 inches of RWA45 mounted on a frame to create a 2 inch trap behind it, and then hung 2 inches off the wall will definitely help, and will only cost about 40 quid for six 2 by 4 foot panels. RWA60 if you want bass traps only as it will reflect more of the higher frequencies.

It'll sound better in there, you won't have to tear down your wall and inject it with foam or build a room within a room, and it will help transmission a bit, worth doing.
60  General / The Forum / Re: KONY 2012 Make Kony Famous - Incredible video on: March 16, 2012, 22:19:27
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/jason-russell-san-diego-invisible-children-kony-2012-142970255.html

Well I thought he was just a greedy christian trying to make a career out of his defunct charity.

Turns out he's also fond of wanking in public on drugs, maybe he's not such a bad guy after all?
61  Food for your Ears / The Desk / Re: Sound Proofing. on: March 16, 2012, 02:16:36
Build some acoustic absorber panels out of rockwool RWA45, there's loads of guides on the internet - won't absorb all the bass but it will definitely help.
62  General / The Exchange / Re: Yamaha hs-50m studio monitors for sale £170 on: March 14, 2012, 18:30:16
These are on ebay now, will still accept £170 if not going through ebay and to pick up from me Smiley

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=251016180190#ht_513wt_1187
63  General / The Exchange / NOT for sale anymore on: March 09, 2012, 18:46:59
Haven't really researched the prices but make me an offer Smiley
64  General / The Forum / Re: Cubase, asio4all and crackling sounds.... on: March 07, 2012, 16:40:05
You are a star man much appreciated help here!

Fuck off your mates PC and use your macbook mate Smiley

Also you have increased the buffer size to max and it's still doing it?
65  General / The Forum / Re: The downgrading of St. Pauls Carnival on: March 03, 2012, 19:22:05
I wonder if the St Pauls people could be contacted to name a figure and a deadline for an amount of money that needs to be raised in order to get the soundsystems part of the carnival back? Did anyone who went to the meeting ask about that? I bet if "x is needed by x" was put out there, various fundraisers and offers from advertisers could be put forward and organised by the community.

They were asked multiple times over the course of the meeting... but the organisers didnt have that information to hand, and couldnt tell us what the 'x by x' was

So then has the decision has been made now and nothing can be changed for this year?

66  General / The Forum / Re: The downgrading of St. Pauls Carnival on: March 02, 2012, 19:20:44
Also to everyone who is kicking off about donations, remember that they receive 28k in income from the stalls that you spend your money at, and 6k from the bar you buy your drinks at.

I'd prefer to buy more jerk chicken and get way more pissed and know I'm getting something in return than to donate my money to a company that gives such vague financial information out and has a large proportion of its budget dedicated to wages.
67  General / The Forum / Re: The downgrading of St. Pauls Carnival on: March 02, 2012, 19:15:05
There would be a whole lot less conjecture and assumption in this thread if people would take 5 minutes to read the accounts before making wild claims about how much everything costs and how much it should cost, it really doesn't take long.

The bottled water / product in aid of the carnival thing is a great idea by the way, and could be a sustainable source of income even outside of carnival time.

Did the carnival people say it was purely due to funds that the soundsystems won't happen this year?

I wonder if they have tried to negotiate licensing / council cost discounts in light of the amount of money that comes in to the economy, would be good if anyone knows how many outsiders are said to come in each year to work out the economic contribution and/or multiplier.
68  General / The Forum / Re: Anybody on here own a .com domain? If so, read on... on: March 02, 2012, 18:56:31
If you really want to hide, there's onion. There's always onion. And it is beautiful (but not robust in a name-resolution sense). But it's not for my mum or the old lady with the independent knitting shop or the lass with learning difficulties who needs some impartial information on abortion. Those people, to have any hope in hell at all, need their ISP and software manufacturer to keep all the technical detail wrapped up neatly behind the scenes. And achieving that at all would require a migration from the extant system under ICANN and IANA guidance. Essentially its hard to see a P2P or "democracy 2.0" system being accessible to disadvantaged or ill-educated people without at least a non-technical/non-administrative governing authority for ISPs to look to when deciding how and when to process name requests. Hence why I'm all for the big fight for liberty rather than the "ignore them and they'll go away" approach.

Yes of course there are always alternatives for the technical user, I love how mysterious the media try and make Onion networks sound, makes me chuckle!

I was under the impression that the DNS servers will automatically choose the right ip for a given url based on popularity, so that an alternative could usurp the current assignment without "too much" of a hitch - as in, if abortionadvice.com were blocked by ICANN and then it were hosted on openDNS or whatever, then eventually traffic would automatically be routed to the right ip - is that not the case? Does it rely on an ISP choosing the right IP?

I'm not saying ignore them by any means, because they definitely won't go away. I just think that where you can circumvent stuff like this you always should because it weakens the government opposing it - renders them useless. By fighting them through courts and lobbying you're not only pleading with an institution that demonstrably doesn't care or represent you, you're legitimizing their power in the act.

Even if this DNS thing turns out to be so fundamental to the operation of the net that they can exact some control over it, when there is enough of a demand for uncensored information alternatives will be created, the government might have been there first back in the 70's to set up the infrastructure, but now that companies like Apple have more money than the US sitting around doing nothing, without even needing to steal from anybody, I have faith that alternatives could emerge pretty quickly as government power weakens.
69  General / The Forum / Re: Anybody on here own a .com domain? If so, read on... on: March 02, 2012, 18:28:09
DNS as it stands is not particularly well suited to a free-for-all approach to root services. A hierarchical umbrella leading to the authoritative server clusters, of which there are 13, is the only way to make DNS robust and that situation can only stay in place if all TLDs are recognised by the organisation at the top of that umbrella. A revolution towards non-hierarchy in TLDs would be as much of an upheaval as would a revolution towards non-hierarchy in a national government.

However non-hierarchical authoritative information systems do exist for other purposes. Torrents and magnets are a good example of a completely non-regulated, non-hierarchical system of addressing data which provides accurate and robust canonical records. But identifying a unique torrent across different trackers is a different ballgame than providing robust links to those trackers themselves, which is DNS's bit of work. If some clever cryptanalyst in some uni somewhere comes up with a good P2P authoritative DNS system then unlimited TLDs would become de facto, and use of TLDs to denote any reliable information with respect to origin and intent would go out the window. Of course the trade-off is the absolute freedom and market-based democratic control of the naming system. The specifics of how that system could work are all way above my level of understanding, but I do know that alternate roots in the existing system are not robust enough to be a long term solution.

Well, although I'm no computer scientist, those do sound more like technical problems that can be solved if there is enough of a need for it than unavoidable obstacles. I can understand that having umpteen DNS systems could result in umpteen different versions of hijackbristol.co.uk - but if there are only two, then the one with most traffic prevails? If that is the case as I understand it, then if one of these alternative DNS systems proves to be successful in avoiding shutdown and is adopted as THE alternative, then it should be fairly easy for it to reroute most traffic looking for, say, piratebay, instead of the takedown page replacing it?

The internet has managed to produce lots of ways of getting around government bullshit so far, now that there is a market for a DNS system immune to US intervention, it must surely be only a matter of time before someone provides?

Even if it does make things more unstable, it's better than gambling websites being taken offline because of religious judges in the states!
70  General / The Forum / Re: Anybody on here own a .com domain? If so, read on... on: March 02, 2012, 18:04:45
The problem lies with ICANN's manner of negotiating the contracts with Verisine (which I will deliberately misspell to trip up SkimWords). Interested parties commonly believe that in an open and fair tendering process the wholesale cost of a .com domain would be around $2.88. As it stands Verisine charge over $7 wholesale, and they have a yearly above-inflation increase built into their rolling contract, which continues to roll as long as they satisfy certain conditions laid down by ICANN. ICANN appear to have no desire for open competition on gTLD administration.

The tin-foil on my head says that, since ICANN was essentially spun out of the US DoC 14 years ago and continues to have its' own interest in the IANA regulated and approved by the DoC, then ICANN is most probably still in the pocket of the US government. But they are also under a public memorandum of understanding from that same government to operate "in a bottom up, consensus driven, democratic manner". In order to best achieve that ICANN should be absorbed into the UN, which there was talk of until the US govt objected. The situation wouldn't be perfect, but it'd at least provide a veneer of international participation in the regulation of these things.

Anyway the point I'm making with all of this is that the control of gTLDs is awarded by a body which is in itself open to extreme manipulation by the US. In fact it is only by the good grace of the US that any of us have ccTLDs since they too are awarded (and potentially revoked) by a "supporting organisation" of ICANN. Of course granular control of ccTLD contents is given to the relevant nation, but the very existence of that ccTLD is essentially controlled by ICANN. So, to answer your question, no. We can't set up some new gTLDs without ICANN and potentially the US govt wading in there and fucking it up. And this is why it can not stand.

well if the tin foil hat continues to prove true, won't these gradually replace icann?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_DNS_root
71  General / The Forum / Re: The downgrading of St. Pauls Carnival on: March 02, 2012, 17:50:13
The whole this is bonkers ridiculous mental nuts, 250 thousand pounds to put on??!!! Whut Da Bimbaflex !!?? The level of retard logic used to justify spending two hundred and fifty thousand on a community carnival in a space the size of St pauls is unimaginable.

It shouldnt cost more than 10 grand to put on? the systems are free, the stalls are free, the main stage if scaled back to what it was wouldnt cost much?? policing the event is free you say? elite security cant be charging much? the procession wont cost much! as 90% of the materials used for costumes and such comes from scrapstore which is cheap as a plate of jerk chicken. Spose the clean up the next day might cost a few grand?

What a piss take and a joke.


Read the accounts! 235 grand to put it on, 79k to pay wages for the company that puts it on, 85k in "events management" which would ideally be broken down more, and another 77k in various other stuff - it definitely all adds up.
72  General / The Forum / Re: The downgrading of St. Pauls Carnival on: March 02, 2012, 17:43:34
Ha! See edit above  Smiley

£17,092  2008/09

So the carnival is costing £250k this year they say? Well even if police cost is more than double that, what are we spending £200k on? Traffic cones?

Here is a link to the annual accounts...

http://www.stpaulscarnival.co.uk/sites/default/files/St%20Pauls%20Afrikan%20Caribbean%20Carnival%20%20TRUSTEES%20REPORTand%20ACCOUNTS%20FOR%202010-11.pdf

major costs seem to be 79k on wages and salaries and 85k on "events management" - this one is a  bit confusing as a lot of the other costs I would associate with events management are detailed separately.

Apparently they get policing for free according to the constabulary link someone posted a few threads back (or did in 2008/9 anyway)

Also donations were up to 4.5k from 2.7k in the previous year - total budget is 235 grand, so we can put to rest the idea that it's our fault for not chipping in enough this year past.

Seems to me like they need to get more adverts and sponsorship in there, which fell by over twice as much as the increase in donations in 2011 and only make up about 10 grand, surely there's got to be room for more than 10 grand in advertising and sponsorship to a 90,000 event?

I wonder how much licensing costs are factored into the events management part of the accounts as it doesn't seem to pop up anywhere else, maybe the council could be persuaded to ease up on the extortion, if that's a big cost? EDIT: it is on the accounts, but only 322 quid compared to 1700 in 2010? Surely the council ask for more than that?


I wonder if the St Pauls people could be contacted to name a figure and a deadline for an amount of money that needs to be raised in order to get the soundsystems part of the carnival back? Did anyone who went to the meeting ask about that? I bet if "x is needed by x" was put out there, various fundraisers and offers from advertisers could be put forward and organised by the community.

Id be interested to know how those figures might look if we take into account how much money the festival brings into the economy here in bristol. We could chip in more, but from what i can tell, many people spend big bucks that weekend.

Well we could always estimate that, and if the figure turns out to be useful it could be a good argument to get some investment from the council or charities set up to benefit the Bristol economy - but to do it properly we'd need to have a carnival go by without the sound systems first, in order to know the difference in turnout.

Is it known or estimated how many people from outside Bristol are in attendance? Impossible to know whether the people who reside in Bristol already would be likely to spend their cash here if they weren't at Carnival.
73  General / The Forum / Re: Anybody on here own a .com domain? If so, read on... on: March 02, 2012, 17:34:42
But all the other alternative domains are ccTLD's and, by nature and by design, subject to national regulation. The gTLD system is meant to be above all that, again by design and by nature. The gTLD system is meant to prevent us from having to choose our domain name, and potentially periodically change it, based on the whims and practices of a nation. If the surpanational domain names are subject to national control then (and this is a better analogy) its like one country seizing control of the international waters and imposing their domestic law upon them. It should not stand.

Well the UN was set up to be supranational to govern and manage the international system without any of the bullshit that comes from within nation states. As it happened it was just a reflection of US power at the time, which is why they veto anything that has a remote chance of impeding their interests.

Seems to me like the gTLD system is much the same, it is supposed to do all the things you say, but really is managed by US companies, who have to do what judges in Maryland want them to do, and it was probably intended to operate in that kind of way all along (it was originally administered by the DoD after all!)

States are trying to claim international waters and other things that don't belong to them all the time, that's basically what they do, steal and appropriate what resides in "their" geographical area.

I don't know an awful lot about the domain name system, but from what I understand Verisign manage the .com domain, which would mean any .com site can now be taken down by a court order from within the US.

The way to win the fight against this isn't to get them to admit they were wrong or complain so much that they do anyway, it's to show them that whatever they try and do, it doesn't work, hence blockaid / moving away from anything to do with the USA, which is what will surely happen. In my eyes fighting on their own terms just strengthens their control, bypassing it weakens them directly.

Couldn't new gTLD's be set up that are genuinely free from this kind of thing, with distributed centres that manage them or something?
74  General / The Forum / Re: Yamaha hs-50m studio monitors for sale £180 on: March 02, 2012, 17:03:30
what are you upgrading to?

Got some Dynaudio BM6A Mk. II's about two weeks ago Smiley
75  General / The Forum / Re: Anybody on here own a .com domain? If so, read on... on: March 02, 2012, 16:44:58
You miss the point. Its malappropriation of a resource which is valuable and meant to be a global commodity. Its the same as them starting to take away water and air because they don't like what colour we've dyed it. You can't just leave it at "it'll come back to bite them". Fuck that.

Well I see the comparison, but water and air are not substitutable goods, unlike .com domains, if America started stealing our air and water, we'd all die, so the only possible response would be to fight to get it back.

If they start acting like cunts over the usage of .com, all they do is drive internet business offshore where they can't control it, or make any money from it either.

It will come back to bite them, because .com is just three letters and there are plenty more domains out there to replace it, American religious retard lawmakers in Maryland will just end up screwing up their country out of money and e-business in the long run by acting like they own the internet. Frankly I'm happy that they've started to turn their back on the only thing that currently puts them ahead of China, because it will mean their powerbase and capacity for murder declines ever faster as they get ever stupider.

In the end, fighting actions like this on their own terms will be futile, circumventing them and proving how the internet has rendered the state powerless to exert control over it will succeed, and already is succeeding.
76  General / The Forum / Re: The downgrading of St. Pauls Carnival on: March 02, 2012, 16:31:58
Ha! See edit above  Smiley

£17,092  2008/09

So the carnival is costing £250k this year they say? Well even if police cost is more than double that, what are we spending £200k on? Traffic cones?

Here is a link to the annual accounts...

http://www.stpaulscarnival.co.uk/sites/default/files/St%20Pauls%20Afrikan%20Caribbean%20Carnival%20%20TRUSTEES%20REPORTand%20ACCOUNTS%20FOR%202010-11.pdf

major costs seem to be 79k on wages and salaries and 85k on "events management" - this one is a  bit confusing as a lot of the other costs I would associate with events management are detailed separately.

Apparently they get policing for free according to the constabulary link someone posted a few threads back (or did in 2008/9 anyway)

Also donations were up to 4.5k from 2.7k in the previous year - total budget is 235 grand, so we can put to rest the idea that it's our fault for not chipping in enough this year past.

Seems to me like they need to get more adverts and sponsorship in there, which fell by over twice as much as the increase in donations in 2011 and only make up about 10 grand, surely there's got to be room for more than 10 grand in advertising and sponsorship to a 90,000 event?

I wonder how much licensing costs are factored into the events management part of the accounts as it doesn't seem to pop up anywhere else, maybe the council could be persuaded to ease up on the extortion, if that's a big cost? EDIT: it is on the accounts, but only 322 quid compared to 1700 in 2010? Surely the council ask for more than that?


I wonder if the St Pauls people could be contacted to name a figure and a deadline for an amount of money that needs to be raised in order to get the soundsystems part of the carnival back? Did anyone who went to the meeting ask about that? I bet if "x is needed by x" was put out there, various fundraisers and offers from advertisers could be put forward and organised by the community.
77  General / The Exchange / Yamaha hs-50m studio monitors for sale £180 on: March 02, 2012, 16:10:55
They are in v good condition, about 2 years old, original boxes with all the foam and stuff intact - selling due to upgrade.

These are about £270 new at the moment and are going for between 180 and 220 on gumtree from what I can tell.

Slight scratch on one of the edges on the top but purely cosmetic.



78  General / The Forum / Re: Anybody on here own a .com domain? If so, read on... on: March 02, 2012, 15:58:15
lose another slice of power by making everyone migrate away from your domains.

away from your domains.

your domains.

your domains.

your domains.

.net, .com and .org are non-territorial, generic top-level domains. They are NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT "their domains". They are OUR FUCKING DOMAINS.

OMG why do so many people not know that.

Doesn't really matter who they belong to in theory or on paper, if the US can take them down whenever they want they belong to them in a de facto sense and will drive websites away from .com and therefore verisign and therefore the usa.
79  General / The Forum / Yamaha hs-50m studio monitors for sale £180 on: March 02, 2012, 15:55:38
They are in v good condition, about 2 years old, original boxes with all the foam and stuff intact - selling due to upgrade.

These are about £270 new at the moment and are going for between 180 and 220 on gumtree from what I can tell.

Slight scratch on one of the edges on the top but purely cosmetic.



80  General / The Forum / Re: Anybody on here own a .com domain? If so, read on... on: March 02, 2012, 15:34:26
Heard about this a couple of days ago, stupid Americans, way to fuck yourselves over and lose another slice of power by making everyone migrate away from your domains.

Luckily for the internets, tactics like this will fail as all other attempts to enforce intellectual property rights online have.

http://www.blockaid.me/ is a service that will overcome domain name seizures, and will probably be a fairly standard tool pretty soon for the internet user who visits sites likely to be blocked by the censors.
81  General / The Forum / Re: plans to change st pauls carnial ... is this true ??? on: February 25, 2012, 17:39:03
Its not YOUR money.

If the council gives the carnival a "six figure sum" and this is in fact true, is it not our money that fund the carnival? Partially at least?
82  General / The Forum / Re: Post you SoundCloud tunes - Feb 2012 on: February 18, 2012, 21:46:30
<a href="https://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F37063600" target="_blank">https://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F37063600&amp;</a>

Another one from myself and Spydogen!
83  General / The Forum / Re: This is not a PC vs Mac debate... on: February 16, 2012, 11:16:52
Actually working on a mac day in day out is easier and faster due to the well-designed operating system, these days the application and optimization aren't really any better than on pc, although compatibility issues will come up less frequently in my experience.

Spotlight, expose, the dashboard for dragging and dropping between apps, file and folder management, lack of crashes or interruptions, fonts, integrated dropbox and idisk etc, colour calibration.... are all very useful and well implemented on macs.
84  General / The Forum / Re: Soundcloud - Help! on: February 08, 2012, 19:41:21

What it might be... is that the inbuilt version of flash that chrome comes with is conflicting with a version you've installed, this happened to me on my mac, here's how i fixed it

http://techlogon.com/2011/08/11/shockwave-flash-crashes-in-google-chrome/

It's dead easy Smiley
85  General / The Forum / Re: The Bristol Pound on: February 07, 2012, 21:44:26

Ironically, you're actually supporting wars like this by buying in in the first place. Credit Unions (and the people they bank with) buy government bonds to keep as capital so they can lend, which means that a portion of every bristol pound you buy from the credit union gets lent to the government.
86  General / The Forum / Re: The Bristol Pound on: February 07, 2012, 14:56:19
it didn't allow them to control where their money ended up.

Once they've spent it it isn't theirs any more? Its a real easy argument to make that, in the interests of a free market, one should stake no claim to how money is used once it has left one's care.

edit: I think bitcoin is amazing though. Bitcoin itself won't survive imo, because the "real life" hardware and power costs of mining already eclipse the returns despite only one third of the mining being done. The exponential nature of the growth of the system makes the difficulty of mining grow exponentially (provided said growth in total network processing power continues unabated), and seeing as mining privately is already not profitable I wouldn't expect the cap to be reached before the system is superseded by an improvement based upon it. Perhaps the cap never being reached will not be a negative. Even a third of the cap, as we presently have available, presents enough of the smallest trade-able unit to keep the currency usable in spite of deflation in the millions of percent. The worry is mass desertion to a new currency, with the inherent easier mining in the early life of the system attracting people away from bitcoin. There's a ways to go, but if ever the phrase "democracy 2.0" was embodied it is in bitcoin.

No it's not theirs anymore, but there is information embedded within the acceptance of BP as money that conveys to the buyer a commitment to the local economy. You make decisions like this every time you spend money, all the people who try to shop ethically do it consciously - this just makes it easier and takes away the element of trust, you can also be fairly certain that the money will keep flowing around bristol, not for instance go from shopkeeper > distributor > evil megacorp.

Sterling doesn't convey information about the eventual destination of the revenue from your purchase, which is why a lot of locally minded people like this kind of idea.

Bitcoin failed because it wasn't secure, the expense of extraction didn't matter - all the exchanges got hacked and the money stolen because the bitcoins weren't encrypted. I think as long as bitcoin was secure and anonymous that was where it got most of its value. I can't remember the stats, but I think much more than half of the mining was done by botnets or other distributed networks (university computers), so the cost of extraction didn't really factor in to it.

Money is worth as much as it is useful anyway, not how much it costs to produce! If I couldn't buy drugs and child porn with Bitcoins then all I would own was a token that represented processing power.

Bitcoin hasn't failed. It currently has a market cap of around $46,000,000. Which is far from worthless. There's around 15,000 BTC (approx £45,000) in transactions per hour at the moment. The very nature of the mining of bitcoins is based on established cryptography. The wallets weren't originally encrypted but users can now opt in to wallet encryption. Modern computers use more power when they are crunching, so a University which allows a distributed mining effort still does pay for extra electricity. There is economy over and above what can be achieved with a dedicated rig, of course, but a good GPU can process around 3000 hashes a second, compared to around 200-300 on a CPU, so a single gaming rig is potentially as fast as 10 workstations with on-board GFX which need to use their CPU instead of a vertex shading GPU to run hash checks. In short the sort of kit that universities don't have much of is better at bitcoin mining than the sort of stuff that universities have.

A true compromise of the bitcoin ecosystem, after recent improvements to the protocol, requires one to control over 50% of the active nodes afaik. And even then you can't, can't, can't steal someone else's money. You can double-spend your own and you can refuse to validate the transactions of others but you can not steal within the bounds of the system. Using a trojan to steal a wallet was how that was previous achieved, and now with wallet encryption that hole is plugged.

To clarify, it will die. But it is far from dead.

Well it still failed with the hack, and is undoubtedly still worth less than it was before that, no? My point about the distributed computer systems is that in a large amount of cases, the people who were mining weren't paying for any of the electricity, so it didn't factor into the price of a coin too much, it was more about what you could buy with them - this is why the price collapsed when the hack happened because of the value of the coins went down, not the cost.

Good that they've patched the wallets though, I hope it carries on working!
87  General / The Forum / Re: An equal-value system of economics on: February 07, 2012, 14:30:07
This is just the venus project or early communist russia before everyone starved and they had to reinstate money.

Also with aliens.

"Some extraterrestrial societies (such as on several Pleiadian planets) have a system called the equal value system, which is a reflection of their beliefs about abundance and the free state of their society."

"Any planet can eventually develop this type of society. However, it cannot happen now on Earth while you are in the present level of fear."

If we all stop being scared we can all have ferrari's yaaaaaaaaay!
88  General / The Forum / Re: The Bristol Pound on: February 07, 2012, 14:23:29
How do you first get the Bristol Pound money? do you go and exchange real money with them and do they hold it and you can change it baxck whenever?

This is what I was wondering. If you can change it back whenever then surely it kind of defeats the point.

Also if you spend a Bristol pound in a shop can they only give you change in Bristol pounds? If so then will all people who accept the currency need to keep separate accounts for it?
Finally in the BBC video report they talk about making online payments and mobile payments. So presumably these will need to be done via a bank of some sort (we don't have the capability ourselves of converting the hard currency into something that can be spent online) are they setting up a "Bristol Bank" to manage this then?



Presumably the credit union which is backing the currency will escrow electronic transactions.

And lend out all the money you deposit with them through fractional reserve banking, and then call on deposit insurance from the government if it all goes wrong!
89  General / The Forum / Re: The Bristol Pound on: February 07, 2012, 14:22:23
it didn't allow them to control where their money ended up.

Once they've spent it it isn't theirs any more? Its a real easy argument to make that, in the interests of a free market, one should stake no claim to how money is used once it has left one's care.

edit: I think bitcoin is amazing though. Bitcoin itself won't survive imo, because the "real life" hardware and power costs of mining already eclipse the returns despite only one third of the mining being done. The exponential nature of the growth of the system makes the difficulty of mining grow exponentially (provided said growth in total network processing power continues unabated), and seeing as mining privately is already not profitable I wouldn't expect the cap to be reached before the system is superseded by an improvement based upon it. Perhaps the cap never being reached will not be a negative. Even a third of the cap, as we presently have available, presents enough of the smallest trade-able unit to keep the currency usable in spite of deflation in the millions of percent. The worry is mass desertion to a new currency, with the inherent easier mining in the early life of the system attracting people away from bitcoin. There's a ways to go, but if ever the phrase "democracy 2.0" was embodied it is in bitcoin.

No it's not theirs anymore, but there is information embedded within the acceptance of BP as money that conveys to the buyer a commitment to the local economy. You make decisions like this every time you spend money, all the people who try to shop ethically do it consciously - this just makes it easier and takes away the element of trust, you can also be fairly certain that the money will keep flowing around bristol, not for instance go from shopkeeper > distributor > evil megacorp.

Sterling doesn't convey information about the eventual destination of the revenue from your purchase, which is why a lot of locally minded people like this kind of idea.

Bitcoin failed because it wasn't secure, the expense of extraction didn't matter - all the exchanges got hacked and the money stolen because the bitcoins weren't encrypted. I think as long as bitcoin was secure and anonymous that was where it got most of its value. I can't remember the stats, but I think much more than half of the mining was done by botnets or other distributed networks (university computers), so the cost of extraction didn't really factor in to it.

Money is worth as much as it is useful anyway, not how much it costs to produce! If I couldn't buy drugs and child porn with Bitcoins then all I would own was a token that represented processing power.
90  General / The Forum / Re: Ben Goldacre explains how the NHS is being privatised on: February 06, 2012, 20:15:35
Ben - I'm sure this is a gross oversimplification of the arguments on my part but isn't the whole idea behind Positive Money to oppose what it sees as the privatisation of money creation? Why is privatisation bad in that instance but good in others?

not an oversimplification at all that's spot on - what we have at the moment is a state sponsored monopoly in money/banking, there originally used to be competition, and then the banks / the state set up central banks and the monopoly.

I now think I would prefer privatised money over renationalised money, so yeah my opinions have changed. However, I don't think anyone will ever convince the state to give up power over its source of income though, it needs to be circumvented by allowing competition, which would mean voluntary taxation (also probably never going to happen while states are still powerful).

What I'm still fairly convinced of is that, in the meantime, it would be better for the state to renationalise money properly as per the proposals than to keep what we have going until it falls apart. I do have problems with the ethics of giving the state more power in general though, maybe it would be better to allow it all to fail, but then making such a major change might lead to calls for allowing other currencies if it goes wrong or the redefining of the state into something good.

I don't work for PM anymore by the way!
91  General / The Forum / Re: Ben Goldacre explains how the NHS is being privatised on: February 06, 2012, 18:43:28
Just to bring up a quick pro privatisation point, First isn't privatised, it's a state granted monopoly (unless I'm very much mistaken), even if you and I could do it much cheaper and better, we're not allowed to, which is why first is so shit in the first place. The argument in favour of privatisation is competition increases efficiency, if there isn't any competition it's not privatisation Smiley



That's just lexical pedantry at the end of the day though, isn't it? You don't call the local bus routes privatised because there's no competition in terms of consumer choice, but the local government would call it privatised because private companies tender competitively for the routes once or twice a decade. I'm not sure how differing with the language used in official channels gets anyone anywhere. I'm also not sure how private providers would end up being treated any differently by the PCT bureaucracies than bus companies currently are by the local council bureaucracies.

In that specific instance I think it was relevant because in my eyes First wouldn't be shit if there was competition - so it doesn't stand as a good example where privatisation fails because it's where state granted monopolies fail for the same reasons private monopolies fail.

Yes the government do refer to state granted monopolies and competitive markets as the same thing, which is largely to cover up for the fact that the Tories are nepotists and not free marketeers, I think this is wrong, but I think it's important to distinguish between privatised industries with markets and state monopolies when talking about whether privatisation works.
92  General / The Forum / Re: Ben Goldacre explains how the NHS is being privatised on: February 06, 2012, 18:23:35
Just to bring up a quick pro privatisation point, First isn't privatised, it's a state granted monopoly (unless I'm very much mistaken), even if you and I could do it much cheaper and better, we're not allowed to, which is why first is so shit in the first place. The argument in favour of privatisation is competition increases efficiency, if there isn't any competition it's not privatisation Smiley

93  General / The Forum / Re: The Bristol Pound on: February 06, 2012, 17:47:52
Surely the only way this could keep the money in the local economy would be to stigmatize people who convert it back to sterling, or worse prevent them from doing so?

Not really, there is enough disincentive (the effort) in transferring your bristol pounds back into sterling (or getting any in the first place if you don't believe in it) to mean that more often than not the money stays in circulation. Brixton, Lewes and Stroud pounds have all maintained circulation more or less.

Sorry ben, i know ur a fan of the idea, even have helped nudge it along, but cant u see that this is putting people into a box, its going to restrict their ability to operate in this so called reflexive world, we cant allow any measures that put human beings into closed systems. It might look good on the face of it, but its just another baby step toward the 'green sustainable economy aka 2050' , its not right, its just not right, look at the bigger picture ffs.

Just for the record, I'm not a "fan" of the idea, but I think people should be free to set up local currencies if they choose to. How is allowing somebody to set up their own currency that you are free to use or not to use as you wish putting people into a closed system?

I'm not quite sure what you think "the plan" is with the 2050 thing, and to what level coercion is going to be used to enforce it, but let's say for a second that you are right and that it's baby steps towards something bad...

All these currencies are set up by people who want to model money as something to, in their own eyes, achieve a goal that isn't happening now. I think we can agree that these innovators aren't complicit in the grand scheme, and they have looked at the world as it is now and want to change it using money. Some of them end up producing the bristol pound, and others have gone on to produce things like bitcoin.

Is it perceivable that if the same people who desire change see these local currencies working against their goals, they might innovate again as they have done today and circumnavigate the grand plan?

Where you see local COMPLEMENTARY currency schemes playing into the hands of the state / UN grand plan, I see them as baby steps towards breaking free of any possible plans laid by the state completely. This is why bitcoin was so vigorously opposed by the Senate in the states, because it threatens the very existence of the state.

As soon as people see heavy regulation involving complementary local currencies, they might again innovate to get around what they perceive to be the undesirable elements of it.  If they choose to break free of fiat currencies completely, taxation becomes utterly impossible, as people just start being paid in the alternative, or switching to yet another alternative if the government starts taxing that - coercive taxation becomes impossible. complementary currencies like these are good for keeping things local, but they also get people thinking differently about money, and what gives it value. Right now money has value because if you don't use it, you get thrown in jail. If people start to disagree with this idea, they will invent their own money.

Of course the UN are trying to harness schemes like this to fit in with sustainability objectives, but it is also because they don't want them to evolve into something that all states fear, free banking and competing currencies....

There's lots of literature on free banking and denationalised currencies, you might be interested in reading some Murrary Rothbard or Hayek (denationalising money) if you haven't already, would be useful to see the other path that innovation in currency could take us down...

People invented these currencies because they felt like the pound was too restrictive, it didn't allow them to control where their money ended up. If people see vast supranational institutions usurping these systems so that the money ends up where THEY want it, they will simply innovate again and fuck off the fiat currency completely, it has happened already with bitcoin and it will happen again.
94  General / The Forum / Re: Experts say that "sugar should be controlled like alcohol and tobacco..." on: February 06, 2012, 17:21:15
would we even need consumer protection or legal aid if taxation was voluntary?

What kind of a fucking stupid question is that? I'm out, man. Its like arguing with a fucking child.

Nice ragequit, I tihnk you misunderstood the question though, would there really be a gaping hole in society where consumer protection and legal aid once stood, or would markets and voluntary taxation continue to provide, just without all the policing of morals? Even if they wouldn't is that a justification for theft? If so, why? the ethical burden of proof is upon the person who steals my income to prove to me that it is worth it.

I just find it hard to believe that stealing my money for the bad things the state does, but also to give me consumer protection and healthcare - is more ethical than voluntary taxation with consumer protection, healthcare, and legal aid if i choose it, and not if I don't.

How can you force someone into giving their money away for murder, and justify it on the basis that the state also provides something we could quite easily have if we gave up the money willingly. How can you justify forcing me to pay for it just on the basis that you feel disagree with me?

I think a child would find that difficult to swallow as well so maybe you're right.
95  General / The Forum / Re: The Bristol Pound on: February 06, 2012, 16:45:32
Surely the only way this could keep the money in the local economy would be to stigmatize people who convert it back to sterling, or worse prevent them from doing so?

Not really, there is enough disincentive (the effort) in transferring your bristol pounds back into sterling (or getting any in the first place if you don't believe in it) to mean that more often than not the money stays in circulation. Brixton, Lewes and Stroud pounds have all maintained circulation more or less.
96  General / The Forum / Re: Experts say that "sugar should be controlled like alcohol and tobacco..." on: February 06, 2012, 16:42:03
God and jesus combined. Privatise healthcare and I won't look back in anger even once just so long as it puts a sock in the likes of all your condescending, pompous gobs about trying to control the choices of others.

how can one be more controlling over choice than to hold a gun to someones head and demand up to half their income every year for things they don't want.

Actually I quite like a strong legal system, schools for children, knowing there's some money to help the disabled and the desperate.... Also museums and art galleries (some of). Vaccination programs, thats a good one. Milk for young kids in schools is nice too. Oh and a whole stack of publicly funded regulators trying (although often failing) to make the marketplace a safe and pleasant place for me to get the things I need with the remainder of my earnings. This idea that taxes go on things people don't want is just daft. I suspect you don't really believe it yourself.

So you think if taxation was voluntary we wouldn't have any of those things?

I think if taxation was voluntary it wouldn't be taxation it'd be spending. And people spend on what they need when they need it, with very little foresight. I think nobody would stump up for consumer protection or legal aid until they needed it, at which point it'd be too late.

So the fact that some people are short sighted justifies holding a gun to my head for my money? - would we even need consumer protection or legal aid if taxation was voluntary?
97  General / The Forum / Re: Experts say that "sugar should be controlled like alcohol and tobacco..." on: February 06, 2012, 16:38:58
God and jesus combined. Privatise healthcare and I won't look back in anger even once just so long as it puts a sock in the likes of all your condescending, pompous gobs about trying to control the choices of others.

how can one be more controlling over choice than to hold a gun to someones head and demand up to half their income every year for things they don't want.

Actually I quite like a strong legal system, schools for children, knowing there's some money to help the disabled and the desperate.... Also museums and art galleries (some of). Vaccination programs, thats a good one. Milk for young kids in schools is nice too. Oh and a whole stack of publicly funded regulators trying (although often failing) to make the marketplace a safe and pleasant place for me to get the things I need with the remainder of my earnings. This idea that taxes go on things people don't want is just daft. I suspect you don't really believe it yourself.

So you think if taxation was voluntary we wouldn't have any of those things? Or at least lose more of the bad things like state sponsored murder, imprisonment for drug usage, unnecessary bureaucracy, economic imperialism, £800bn bank bailouts, than the good things - like museums, or schools where we get to learn what the state wants us to learn?
98  General / The Forum / Re: Experts say that "sugar should be controlled like alcohol and tobacco..." on: February 06, 2012, 14:54:44
God and jesus combined. Privatise healthcare and I won't look back in anger even once just so long as it puts a sock in the likes of all your condescending, pompous gobs about trying to control the choices of others.

how can one be more controlling over choice than to hold a gun to someones head and demand up to half their income every year for things they don't want.
99  General / The Forum / Re: The Bristol Pound on: February 06, 2012, 14:12:55
It's a nice idea but the only people who will accept payment in Bristol pounds are people who would spend their money locally anyway. No-one who wants to spend their money in Tesco or McDonald's is going to voluntarily adopt a currency which can only be spent in independent outlets.

That's the point, you know if you pay someone in Bristol pounds that the money will only flow locally, so one can spot a shop with a commitment to the local economy simply by the fact you can pay them in bristol pounds - don't need to speak to them or trust that they're buying local, all the information is already transmitted by their choice of currency.

These ideas will only start to get real legs when they move away from being "complementary" with a 1:1 parity with the pound, to being able to buy in for 90p or just not based on the pound whatsoever, that's a way off yet though.

Last time I spoke to the Bristol pound guys they were trying to convince the council to allow rates to be paid in Bristol Pounds (I can almost see Wes doing backflips) - does anybody know if they got permission?
100  General / The Forum / Re: Ben Goldacre explains how the NHS is being privatised on: February 05, 2012, 19:43:26
The NHS does not need reform. Nor does it need to have added layers of beurocracy.

It is the most cost effective health service on the green earth.

If anything, it needs greater investment.

I would also like to add Goldacre is wrong on this imo.

I don't think throwing extra money at the NHS will solve anything in exactly the same way that radical reforms will, too much change too quickly leads to waste, mistakes, and confusion within the service.

Labour wasted money in spectacular fashion with the NHS, the last thing it needs is more money. My dad works as a consultant for gateway reviews in the health sector and thinks that one of the main reasons things don't work as intended in the NHS is because government don't leave the dust to settle before their next major change in policy.
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